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-All right. Well, the next principle. Number four. This is the MacGyver mentality, OK? So you hire for attitude. So you got to check with the integrity. But then you also you're looking for the right attitude. Now, Tony Hsieh, CEO of Zappos said-- for a little notable quotable herer-- "Every company needs people with different skill sets and passions. But early on, everybody should be willing to wear 10 different hats. They can't have the attitude that something isn't their job or their responsibility. They have to have the MacGyver mentality and do whatever it takes get the job done." Well, we've already said it. Most entrepreneurs have 10 employees or less. Those people have to be willing to do whatever it takes.
-Well, one of the things I want to say because I coach businesses all over the country. And so I don't want to throw any particular business under the bus. I just want to talk in generalities so I don't get myself into trouble here. But there is a business I was working with. And one thing that they did is-- I know this is a huge problem. There are only like seven employees who work there. And the owner was like, we're going to need some people to get on the phone and to call some of our former customers and to survey them and to see if they like our new shopping cart. That should be a pretty simple task.
-Well, of the seven employees or eight employees, one of them says, was I hired to make calls? I thought I was more the IT guy? The other one says, I'm the video person. I don't make calls. I'm a video person. Another person says, I don't know what to say. I don't know what I would say on the phone. I mean, could you maybe make the calls? I prefer more to do the paperwork. And all these people weren't going to make the calls. Now, in my companies, I would say, hey, so you're saying that's not your job? OK. yeah. Well, you know what is your job? Everything. So I need you to get on the phone and make those calls.
And I'm excited about you volunteering. Thank you. And I would just be done with it. I wouldn't ask. Well, this guy, though, comes to me after our big power workshop. He says, we're going to have to hire somebody to make calls because the seven people that I have just are not willing to make those calls. And I would hate to make people work out of their comfort zone. And you can not grow a company this way. To put a specific example, Tony Hsieh-- one thing that a lot of people don't know about this guy is when Zappos was growing, guess what? He was a venture capital guy in this company. Well, when people started buying these products, they didn't have time to hire a bunch of people to ship product.
So Tony was like, I'll roll my sleeves. And I will help do this. So here's the CEO of the company. And he's helping put stuff in the box and to ship it out. He's the CEO. Now, today, you know I'm the CEO of Thrive. But today, all of us, we got up at like 3:00 in the morning, 2:00 in the morning into work on stuff. And I'm not saying, well, you know, I'm not willing to do that. I was hired to be the CEO. And it's executive. You know, we have to do whatever it takes.
And if you're in a small business, have a small business idea and you don't have people willing to do whatever it takes, you're going to struggle. Now, if you're a big business, you can start to hire some specialists. And you can start to hire Craig or Karen, who say, all I want to do is work as the front desk person. And all I really want to do is greet customers and get them coffee. You can do that once the company get bigger because you need a specialist. And if someone wants to spend their whole life greeting people at the front desk and making coffee, that's cool. But you really need people who are gamers, who are will to do whatever it takes to get it done.
-Well, a lot of times, if you're not hiring these people that are comfortable putting on different hats, the person who is, I don't do cold calls, they're probably not going to last for you. You've got to invest in some that's going to stick around. I saw a Forbes article with Mark Murphys, a leadership research expert and CEO of Leadership IQ. He said, "When our research tracked 20,000 zero new hires, 46% of them failed within 18 months. But even more surprising than the failure rate was that when the new hires failed, 89% percent of the time, it was for attitudinal reasons."
-I want to make sure that we're not missing this here because you're saying 46% fail. So I'm saying to you, if you're watching this, fail faster. Fail faster. Fail as fast as possible. Hire two people. Tell them within four hours. Literally, this is within four hours you want to do this. I hire you right now to make cold calls. I hire you right now to work as my receptionist. Within four hours, have me do the task and find out whether I need to be fired or whether I need to continue high to be hired. What did he say? 89%--
-89% percent of those 46 are fired because their attitude.
-Has nothing to do with their background.
-Nothing do with their skills.
-It's unbelievable. But this is true. And I see businesses all across America. Now, we here this a lot. We hear this at these political rallies. We hear this at these generic, blase, Utopian speeches, where they say, American workers are the best employees in the world. I don't care whether you live in Cambodia, or Costa Rica, or United States, or Canada.
I'm going to tell you, at least half of the people that you're going to hire are going to fail. So hurry up and fail faster. And quit trying to hold on to looking for the disbelief, you're going to find the perfect candidate. The perfect candidate is a ton of candidates who get fired. And you end up with one or two.
-So action step. In the interview process, focus on the attitude. You can tell by the way they talk, you can tell by the way they carry themselves. And then have them do the action and see how they respond. Don't focus on the resume. Don't focus on the education or the skills.
-Can I demonstrate the behavior that you want to fire people for immediately?
-Fire them before you hire them.
-This is one. In the interview, they-- I'm going to walk off camera, which I should never do, but I'm doing it because I'm just a wild guy and I break all the rules when it comes to the set. So I'm doing it. And Spence has signed the waiver, so we don't mind filming Spence and his jet pack here.
But here's one. In the interview, they do this. They're like, texting. "Oh, what was that? I'm sorry. Oh. Yeah. Yeah." If they do that during the interview, fire them immediately.
-But what if they're good? What if they're good at social media? What if they're going to be good at-- I mean, what if they've got the skills?
-Phew, phew. Or you do this move. You say, "Hey, if you ever text again in my presence, I will fire you." You just have something like that.
-But you just need to blow them up. Another thing they do. They sit back, yawn, yawn, yawn. "Sorry I just had a long night." Fire them. Before you hire them.
-They show up one minute late to the interview. "Aww, I couldn't find a place to park."
-Bro. Bro-town. Let me tell you what. For your wedding, you're not late. I do public speaking. You're not late for public speaking. You don't show up late to your speaking engagement.
-You show up a day early.
-You know, you show up a day early, and you plan on there being problems. You don't show up late to weddings you don't-- so--
-Yep. And sorry, I've got an incredible cold right now. I'm pushing through the pain though.
-So here we go. Let's move on to principle number five here. Hire visionaries and doers. OK, so we got a notable quotable from Caterina Fake, founder of Flickr. She says, "If you have a lot of visionaries, you'll have a lot of great ideas, something awesome that people will love; but you never get it done. It doesn't ship. Nothing happens.
Now if you have too many execution oriented people on your team, you're executing like mad, things are getting built, things are getting shipped like crazy; but you're building something nobody wants. If you have a good balance of both in your company, you're more than likely to stay on track. Those people complement each other well."
-And you know, I love it. It makes sense. You've done it well on Thrive. You have those people, and often it's you, that's just going to hold people to getting things done. But you've got to have the creative people as well.
-Here's the thing. I just want to make sure you're hearing this. Caterina is talking about how we need to hire these two different groups of people. I definitely am a doer. I prefer to do things. I do not like discussing visions. I just want to shut up and do stuff. Now I also know that. I know myself well enough-- I'm self aware to know that if I don't take time out to dream, then I won't have anything worth doing that I'm doing.
-Now that's tough, because in a meeting I get so frustrated when I hear visionaries talking about Narnia.
-Narnia. And little elves. In the future, we could do-- It frustrates me. But you need to do that though, because if there wasn't Narnia and little elves and Wookies, and-- we wouldn't have "Star Wars" and Disney and iPhone and Apple.
Because somebody at Apple one day had to say, "Wouldn't it be nice if--" they don't all talk that way. Visionaries all talk that way. They'd be like, "Wouldn't it be nice if we had a phone that only had one button and you can swipe it, and there was no--"
And then someone like me is like, stupid. We've got a phone with a cord. Why would you need that? "Wouldn't it be nice if it was cordless?" And we-- But you got to have both. Really important. Love that.
-A "Forbes" article that I read recently said, "While an organization's vision is equivalent to the destination it seeks to reach, action represents the steps taken on the path to get there. Emphasis should be put into both vision and action equally." I mean, it's just what you said. In order for this to thrive, you've got to have both. Or you're going to stay in a very small place.
-I see small businesses every day, all across the country, where you talk to someone and they say, "My vision--" And I've got to go back to my vision voice. "My vision is to serve cupcakes to the world." And you're like, so you want to serve cupcakes to the world. "Oh yes. To help the children." You know, that's great.
Or you'll see someone who's coaching basketball or running a staffing business or roofing. "Our roofs will change the world." And you know, it's great. But then who's going to pick up the phone and make a cold call to call people and to tell them about your product. "Well, I don't know. It's going to be so good it will sell itself." You know, it's not true. So you've got find that balance.
-And you really, you just got to, you gotta-- find both. It's-- you just have to. This is-- Caterina, "Forbes" are dead on here. This is huge.
-Well, and even taking this principle a step further. When you do your hiring process right now for Thrive, you cast that vision for Thrive.
-And the people that buy into it, get excited about it, you see that look in their eye.
-You know that you're not going to have to come behind them with the whip every day. They're going to be self-motivated because they caught that vision, right?
-Right. Well, and then what happens is, right now is we're growing. I'm taking note. And I look around the room, and people who are not into the vision, and who are like, well, do I have to read this book? I have a lot of books I'm reading right now. You mean I have to read another book? When am I going to find time to read a book?
Then I, mentally I'm like, fire this person as soon as possible. Fire this person. Find a way to fire this person. Let's do the $20 bill test. Hopefully they fail that one. You know, we're trying to find a way to let these people go.
-We are. Because if they don't catch the vision, I want them out of here.
-Well, and it will save you time in the long run. And money. Because a recent "Forbes" study said that 64% of employees visit non-work related sites daily. And of that, 29% waste one to two hours per week, each week, on those sites. And if somebody's just caught the vision of Thrive and is so excited to be a part of this, you're not going to have to be policing everybody's computers, right?
-Well, there was a guy the other day who I had to talk about how he was having a hard time getting his work done. And so I pulled up his internet history, and I just pulled it off and printed it for him. And showed it to him.
-You did that?
-Yeah. It's amazing the conversation we have.
-Because it's just like, what are you doing?
-I mean, you just, you just pull up history. And then you hit the little Command-Shift whatever 4 thing on the Apple. Apple-Shift-4. You screen grab that and you print it off and here you go. And it's a very short conversation, called shut up and get to work.
And it's really-- but this is also a person, though, who you could see the vision is maybe not there. They-- they said it was. They knew how to say the right things. But you kind of caught-- so again, we'll see if that vision aligns. But it's in a-- Thrive is not Narnia. We've got a lot of great people. I'd say 9 out of 10 people who work here, I'm pumped up about.
But just like any business, it's a constant correction. And the way this works is this right here, this is your garden, baby. This is your garden. Here we go. This is my garden, right?
-Well, what happens in a garden when there's weeds?
-Oh, you gotta take them out, man.
-You pull those weeds, man. You get a little bit of that Round Up mess, you know. You get that-- you get that bottle going on here. You get that thing here, and you just start shooting that Round Up and phew, you just kill it all, right there, right? You've got to kill the weeds. So every business, if you see a weed pop up-- you're not weird if you have a weed pop up. You're called a human. But you've got to kill that weed.
-But practically, when you're in the middle of that hiring process, cast that vision. See if they get excited about that. If you can tell that they buy in early, you can save a lot of time here.
-Exactly. If they don't catch that vision and get excited.
-If your vision right now is to build the world's largest basketball coaching facility, and you're like, in the future, we could coach kids from all over the world on the fundamentals of basketball. And if someone's sitting there like, why?
-Yeah. If their eyes don't get big--
-Then you gotta let him go.
-Yeah I fully agree.
-All right, so now moving on to principle number eight.
-This, I think will be your favorite principle. I'm pretty sure this is one your favorites. This is hire fast, fire fast. You alluded to it earlier.
-You talked about how you give people the trial period. I don't think entrepreneurs do that enough. Because it's something you need to take advantage of.
-A trial period. You want to tell the employee, hey, I'm hiring you to come work here for this amount of time. Let's say two weeks or 60 days or 90 days. I recommend in small business, you keep that trial as small as possible.
-So like maybe for two weeks. I'm going to hire you for two weeks. I guarantee I'll pay you during these two weeks. I want to see if you have what it takes. Should you have what it takes, I will continue hiring you. Should you not have what it takes, then I'll move on.
-Right. And so a little notable quotable. This was just one I threw in there just to make you smile, I think. The great Henry Ford once said, "Well, sometimes you just don't like somebody." And sometimes that's all you need. If you do the trial period, and you see they don't match up with my culture. They don't-- this is not somebody I want to be sitting next to. Just let him go.
-There was a guy who-- I'll change his name to Ed.
-And I remember one day I was sitting there. And by the way, I just want to make sure you get the good picture of this. When I started my companies, I had a very hard time with this. So I don't want you to feel like that this is easy for me.
-But I remember--
-Letting people go.
-Yeah. But I remember I was working at my house. It was a home office. Into a home office, by the way, they're coming to your house. So this guy's in my house and he says, "Bro, bro, wouldn't it be awesome if like capitalism, it didn't exist, bro. Because like if we didn't need any money, we could spend our time focusing on, like, helping people."
And I said, "Holmes, how much pot have you been smoking?" And he says, "Bro, that's the thing man. Like it's only illegal because, like, of the legislation. But like the hemp law, the reason why hemp is illegal is because just, government man. But really, it's actually better for you than cigarette smoke."
And I'm like. OK, OK, OK. So let's pretend that I didn't hear you say that. You really do prefer socialism over capitalism. "Yeah, I mean work is just like a drain, you know." And I realized like, this guy is the antithesis of what I am. Everything I stand for, he stands against. So what do I do? I kept him on for like a year.
-So every day he's sitting next to me, being like, "Bro, bro. Would it be--" And I'm not exaggerating. He literally talked like this. "Bro. I wrote a poem this weekend. And like this poem I think it just talks about the injustice of American capitalism. Want to hear it?"
-I cannot imagine you having a conversation with this man.
-No, and I kept him on for like a year. And the thing was, because I just felt like there wasn't anybody else out there.
-Like there was this scarcity. Like I could never find an employee. And he knows the passwords. What would I do? I think a lot of business owners who are watching this, they have that dude working for them right now. And I'm saying, if someone doesn't fit your culture, and you've got to move on as quickly as possible. That's why you've got to have that trial period.
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