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This business coaching episode explains how to face the facts regarding managing employees.

Results-Focused Training, Tools, and Workshops from Expert Business Coaches.

Featured Coaching Excerpt - Notes & Transcript, Part 1
  • Lesson Nugget: People who do not get their work done will have plenty of excuses for why it is not finished.
  • Lesson Nugget: The only people who hate bringing accountability and their performance into the light have something to hide.
  • Lesson Nugget: Don't be discouraged or distracted from the situation when you address someone who is not getting their work done and they personally attack you.


-Now here we go. Here we go. Here we go now, here we go now. This is how we're getting real.

CALEB TAYLOR: Here we go.

-So I was working with a consulting client and they brought one of their employees to the meeting.


-And I said, hey, hey, did you get that done? In particular, this case was, did you actually call all the former patients and schedule them for their six-month check up. Did you do it? She-- what, what do you mean?

Well, every day we committed to making 25 calls to former clients to get them in. Did you call them? Uh, uh, what? What do you mean? I didn't know. I didn't know.


-Well, last week it was, I think if you had been better clear, more clear with me, I would've done it.


-Then the week before it was, I don't want to. So this week-- you know, consulting clients pay me to help them grow a company. They don't pay me to sit there and validate their things. So again, if you were ever to hire me as a consultant, I mean, I'm not there to be mean, but I'm there to help you grow.


-So I said, can I be Frank and you can be Sarah, or whatever her name was. Can I be Frank, you can be Sarah? She's like, yeah. And I'm like, you're not doing your job.


-And there's no other personal thing, it's just, you're not doing your job. So I would like to know why you're choosing to not do your job? You're being negligent. You're neglecting your duties.


-You're being insubordinate. You're not subordinating to what you're supposed to do.


-You're just not getting your job. Now, I'm not going to accuse you of being a liar or a time thief, of any of those things that I might feel. I'm just going to say that you're not doing your job.

And she says, oh my gosh, you guys follow-up all the time. And it's just like, if you wouldn't give me so much to do, then I wouldn't have so much, I wouldn't feel so overwhelmed. And if you weren't constantly following up, you guys are always--


-And it's just a personal attack. Because most people, you watch politicians behaving badly--


-They usually never attack the policy.


-They're like, well, guess because Barack Obama's from Africa.


-Let's say that you really do believe that President Obama's from Africa, or let's say you believe that he's from America. Whatever. You're talking about universal health care.


-Let's attack that.


-If you're not into it, attack it. Or yeah, because Mitt Romney's Mormon.


-Let's say he is Mormon. Let's focus on his issue, which is his plan to fix the economy.


-Well, Paul, you know, he's crazy. he's a prepper. He's a prepper.


-If he wasn't into-- they attack each other. You see it in sports too. You get two guys who are going to schedule a boxing match.


-And instead of talking about how I'm going to strategically try to beat you, they start saying, he's a chicken, he's a wuss, his wife is an idiot, he's a-- it's that personal attack.

CALEB TAYLOR: So you're saying as a manager, you have to expect that, though? I mean, you have to expect to be personally attacked like this?

CLAY CLARK: And I'm going to just throw this out here for you. This is the one little deep, deep nugget you need to know, OK? When you set your expectations high, OK? So when you set your expectations high-- make sure we're getting this. When you set them high-- work with me.

When you set those expectations high, then what's going to happen is the average person, the average person, when you do follow up, you do follow up here. This is what's going to happen. They are going to aim low. They're going to punch you below the belt, they're going to do the dirty moves and they're going to personally attack you.

-I want to make sure you get it. When you set your expectations high, poor performers are going to attack you low.


-They're going to get low. You set your expectations high, they're going to start talking about, well, are you good husband to your wife?


-That has nothing to do with the fact that you didn't do the search engine system.


-Literally. When I followed up with this guy about the search engine, his response was, I don't even know if you're following all the Oklahoma labor laws.


-I'm like, what does that have to do with it? He literally brought that up. And I was like, OK. Let's continue. You are a contractor who's working remotely from another state, and I'm doing this because you're semi-related to somebody, and you said you needed to find work while you're going to college. Well, I always have thought you're too intense anyway.

CALEB TAYLOR: There you go.

-That's great.

Featured Coaching Excerpt - Notes & Transcript, Part 2
  • Notable Quotable: "Facing reality sounds simple, but it isn't. I found it hard to get people to see a situation for what it is and not for what it was, or what they hoped it would be." - Jack Welch ( Former CEO of General Electric)
  • Notable Quotable: "Low performances will attack you low."

-I have another notable quotable here for you, if you don't mind. This one is from Jack Welch again, who we talked about. He says, "Facing reality sounds simple, but it isn't. I found it hard to get people to see a situation for what it is and not for what it was, or what they hoped it would be." If you present them with this accountability, reality, you didn't do the SEO, they just can't handle that and they justify it, do they not? -It's human behavior, and I can think back to my time at Applebee's, and I had a boss named Ian. Ian, if you're watching this, I'm so sorry. So sorry. -For your jackassery in the workplace? -Yeah. Ian, though, used to point out-- he used to say, hey man you have customers in your section and you keep not following up with them. Why? And I'm like, well because Sarah over here in this section-- Yeah Applebee's, the way it worked at Applebee's, just so we're clear. Applebee's is a restaurant and they break it up into sections. So they'll say, Employee A you get this section. B,C these are all tables. So my section, let's say, was section A. And Sarah over here at section D sometimes would ask me questions, and so I would go over here and answer her questions. Then someone else would have questions, but really it wasn't about questions. It was about the fact that I was trying to not work. And so he'd be like hey, you need to be at your station to serve your guests, because if your guests want a refill, their glass should never get more than half empty. You guys should always be, always be offering them appetizers, or do you need anything else, are you good? That's how you get a tip. And I was like, no no no no, I got a question from Sara. Well my tips every day were low, because my service quality was low. Then I would go to him and I would say, hey man my section stinks. I could-- dude, this restaurant stinks. I can't stand-- and then he would say, do you know that someone over here in section C is making two times as many tips as you are? And this person over here is making two times as many. I'm like, well yeah it's because they get all the good people. I literally got to a point in my waiting career where I started saying that you guys are just putting me in the bad section. I started blaming everything from the section-- I said in that section there's so much of light that comes in that side of the Applebee's, it gets hot. I remember saying that. I'm like, it gets so hot over there, people don't want to sit there. That's why I always have less people. And he's like, no because you don't take care of the people you have and you never upsell anything so we started sending them to another section. Furthermore, as a waiter, you're supposed to walk up front and greet the guests and say, table for one or table for two? And you don't do that. Back in the day when they said smoking or nonsmoking, you don't do that. You're never available. You're always in the back trying to get yourself some free food. Get focused, man! But what happened is, I couldn't handle it so I went and I attacked him personally. And I remember saying to him, I said well Ian, if you were a better boss, I'd be more motivated. I remember saying that. I remember thinking like, yeah! Because we want to justify. And all I'm saying is that, again, if you have high expectations and you're a manager, understand that low performers will attack you low. -Let me ask you this though, I mean, low performers will attack you low. You started this point by mentioning action items you delegated to people, like [INAUDIBLE], like [INAUDIBLE], like Caleb [INAUDIBLE]. These people actually wanted to show you what they did during your follow up. -Yeah. -So is it different, it's like the people that have something to hide, or how does that work? I mean. -If you're not doing your job, what you want to do is you want to first throw up-- you kind of like, if this is what happens is, if you don't do your job. Let's say that you are just-- you did not do the job. If this is what happens, you usually have got these three moves that everyone does. These are hilarious, but they're funny. One is the miscommunication move. -Yeah. -You go, oh I must have miscommunicated. Because that in our country, for whatever reason, and our continent and our intergalactic system, for whatever reason, if you say that, that gives you a hall pass. There must have been a miscommunication. I didn't know. I didn't know. And that usually will get you off the hook the first time. That's the move. The second move, the second-- there's miscommunication, that's the first one. The second one is you have just sort of a confusion mixed with a busyness. Oh what was that? Oh I'm so sorry, I've got to head-- I am-- I want to circle back. I didn't know. I was kind of confused. So the first time it's miscommunication, the second time it's I'm very busy and I'm confused. Now the third, which is kind of fun, this is where you go into the personal attack. And you want to bring enough drama that the people become afraid of you. -Right. -So most people learn, if you're just crazy, people will stop messing with you. So you can go, why do you always follow up with me? I'm tired of the micro-management! You need to learn something about management!

Featured Coaching Excerpt - Notes & Transcript, Part 3
  • Lesson Nugget: People who do not do what they were supposed to will try to distract you from their incompetence when you follow up with them.

-I literally-- one of the businesses that I work with-- this is hilarious. I go on the floor to observe the staff one day, doing some walk-around management. And an employee, literally, in front of customers, said, man, all you ever do is follow up. When are you going to ask about how I'm doing? How am I doing personally? [LAUGHING] I'm not-- You have never asked how I'm doing. And then they're like, hey, can you calm down? We're in front of customers. CALEB TAYLOR: Oh my god. -He's like, you all might at the wrong business. Because I'll tell you something. They don't even care about their employees. CALEB TAYLOR: Oh gosh! -And then the manager-- I watched it. I was so frustrated. The manager's like, hey, hey, calm down. Can we talk about this outside? So they go outside, and he's like-- [PANTING ANGRILY] I go back a week later. True story. He literally is there. No punishment. CALEB TAYLOR: Wow. Because he went crazy. CALEB TAYLOR: Right. They were scared. -And he was able to-- Oh, oh, I'm scared of you. CALEB TAYLOR: And those people that freak out, though-- I'm guessing the ones that don't freak out don't have anything-- too much to hide, probably. [LAUGHTER] CLAY CLARK: Yeah. So if you're managing people, just understand if they didn't do something, they're going to throw up a smokescreen of miscommunication, a smokescreen of confusion, a smokescreen of attack. And they'll just keep doing it. They're like, oh, oh, there's a miscommunication. Oh, there was some confusion. Oh, there was an attack. CALEB TAYLOR: So you can count on it. If they didn't do it, you're going to get those things. CLAY CLARK: It is hilarious. -And if they did do it, they're not going to care if you follow up. -No. Literally. Like, when I follow up with DJ, every time she's like, yeah. Here's what I did. -Right. -Here's the status. Well, you see it's funny. It's almost like a comedy skit. -I love it. -But I know if someone didn't do it, they're always going to go with the miscommunication move. Then they're going to go with confusion. Then they go with the personal attack. -So what's the action item, then? For this third principle-- accountability makes slackers attack you personally, what do you say to the cyber watcher right now? -Well, if you're managing people, you've probably been very, very good at your job. CALEB TAYLOR: Yeah. -You've probably been very, very good at your job. You've probably been diligent. CALEB TAYLOR: Right. -Or somebody got fired, and all of a sudden, you got promoted before you were ready. But either way, you're here. You're a manager. And you're going to have to learn management skills. And you're going to have to understand that people will attack you and call you a micro-manager. And they're going to come for you, and they're going to make you feel bad. Like, hey, bro, we used to work together in the sales department. Now you're my boss? CALEB TAYLOR: Right. -Now you think you can talk to me that way? Remember, because you were here with everybody else, and now you got promoted. You used to be on the same playing field your co-workers, and now you're their boss. And they're going to attack you. They're gonna try to rock your confidence. They're going to try to do all these things. And you've gotta understand that success is not normal. CALEB TAYLOR: OK. -And so you're going into rare air now. You're moving up the ladder. And so you've gotta understand that this is what happens when you follow up. CALEB TAYLOR: I love it. This is huge. We've gone over three big points here for management. The three points that we covered was-- 1, your follow-up does not cause people to perform poorly. -Mm. -2, you can only expect what you inspect. And 3, accountability makes slackers attack you personally. -Mm. -I feel like this has been huge, though, because you've given us insight into what to expect, given us action items on how to become better managers, and Clay, I just appreciate everything you do for me. -Hey, you're a beautiful man. -Boom!

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